I have a client who hallucinates that she is harming other people subtly and she has gone into an extreme reclusive lifestyle so as to not hurt others. Would you suggest yin or yang energy to help restore balance? Any suggestions are most welcome.

She responds beautifully to the energy sessions, for about 8-12 hours. She is radiant afterwards, then goes into an intense fear of how she is hurting othrs. I have been doing mostly colors/amp/unan - to the chest area -- with sessions every 5 days.

My muscle testing indicates it is emotional, not mental.

Many thanks for giving me direction on how to best help her.

It sounds like you are doing well, but it sounds also that she would do well to feel the emotions about hurting others as you work on her so they are very on display and focused. Yin or Yang would be fine, I would try one for part of the session and then the other for part of the session and ask her which she prefers.

Enjoy the day,

Many thanks for the reply. Your comments make sense, and I'll follow through with them.

Thanks again!

As with any client who is exhibiting severe symptoms, I always remind that we do not diagnose and we do not treat, and that it is the correct legal and moral thing to do, to advise them to seek medical or psychiatric help from licensed providers. (As per Richard Gordon) Emotions ARE mental.

On my form for informed consent, they are advised to be under licensed care in every instance, that QT is ancillary in nature only, and the form is signed, & they are given a copy of the signed form. I will email you the complete form if you PM your email address.

Her symptoms suggest suppressed rage, which can be dangerous, (the most dangerous psychiatric symptom) and while she responds to QT favorably in the short term, that may be a deeply underlying problem that needs psychiatric attention. Hallucinations are the hallmark symptom of schizophrenia. Do you really want her to be feeling and focusing on the feelings of wanting to hurt people when you are working with her? I personally would not. Please be careful.

Love to all.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Ali,

Thanks Ali for taking the time to reply. I always appreciate everyone's input.

As a Licensed Massage Therapist I always do an "Intake Form" so I have full (?) disclosure from the client, and a signature/date. My forms don't include "advising to be under licensed care in every instance" and I don't give them a copy of the signed form. I will send you my email address and would appreciate a sample of what you use. My form says, "I understand that this work does not constitute medical treatment, but rather is a form of health maintenance . . . " I would not find it appropriate to require a client to be under licensed care.

Before I learned QT I did massage plus my own methods of energy work integrated in. Since learning QT, and with no advertising but word of mouth, my practice is 95% QT, but I see that my forms haven't necessarily caught up with the transition.

I am very careful never to diagnose or prescribe. I have never used the word hallucinate with my client or her family. My terminology is more along the lines of "I feel the energy work I do would be very beneficial, but I make no guarantees of results." I do give out pamphlets to almost all clients of where they can get very inexpensive medical tests. These are on the table where they sit and write their checks. I don't recommend any particular doctors or chiropractors. I also recommend www.chilel.com (a form of Qigong)to almost all clients. I don't think any of them follow up on it though.

I do perceive a difference between emotional and mental -- and we could discuss for years which comes first. They are different energies. For treatment purposes, my simple basis is: mental is in the head and emotional is in the chest, and where is the energy wanted, where is the energy disrupted? Where is the energy eratic?

The family members of this particular client are suggesting electric shock treatments. I don't hold back my belief that this would not help her at all. The local mental hospital will not take her because she is not harming herself or anyone else, and they say she is capable of taking care of herself.

Medications given by doctors have made her behavior almost insane and she has refused to take them anymore (that was before seeing me).

I don't personally believe standard psychiatric treatment would help (or helps anybody very much). My brother was schizophrenic -- died from mixing medications with alcohol at age 41 -- and I've been around a lot of mental illeness.

I've had a lot of training in The Work of Byron Katie -- her Cleanse in Malibu, Her School -- and have staffed at her School. The Work may or may not help this client, but would help her family members.

I've had training in martial arts -- am 100 lbs. but can handle whatever comes up. I don't live my life in fear. I don't believe she 'wants' to hurt people, but she does believe she 'is' hurting them just by her presence.

I really see the logic and value of her letting it be OK for those thoughts to come while I am working on her. They are there anyway, why not make them be OK -- What we resist, persists! I can see that 'allowing' them while running energy will make them less resistant to dissolving -- more easily restoring to perfection -- smoothing out. And I really, really like the idea of asking her which she prefers - the yin part or the yang part (without using the words).

QT is needed to get to the deeply underlying conditions. Psychiatry can't get there. The intellect can't get there.
We live in a world of energy - mental, emotion, physical energy - an illusion of energy. I can only try to play the game of being a human. Can't take myself too seriously -- yet need to keep trying to be truly helpful.

I can't really know what is best for this client (or any client). I can't know what is best for her on her own unique path in life.

OK - enough of my rambling --
Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Ali. Thanks heaps, Alain, for all you've taught me (and will continue to teach me, I'm sure).
I'm grateful!

It sounds like you have it all together! This is wonderful to see. Many times, beginners in QT or other healing energy work do not, & it is so easy to go where angels fear to tread, out of naivete and a desire to help.

Thanks for your complete and comprehensive reply. It makes me feel a lot better!

Love to you and your client!

Hi Truth Lover,
Check outside of aura to see/feel/perceive if there is something rejected so far out - check core 2 videos for reminding, Alain shows it far better than I can describe.
With Love,
Jelena

Many thanks for your comments and suggestions. I'll keep you posted!

Truth Lover
Your comments about your client are very interesting.

“I have a client who hallucinates that she is harming other people subtly and she has gone into an extreme reclusive lifestyle so as to not hurt others”

“she does believe she 'is' hurting them just by her presence.”

“She responds beautifully to the energy sessions, for about 8-12 hours. She is radiant afterwards, then goes into an intense fear of how she is hurting others”

It sounds as though she is responding and benefiting from the energy work.
Just from these statements it seems as though she is perceiving something energetically that is very real to her.
Has she told you any specifics of how she thinks that she’s hurting others?

I've asked various questions, and her answers are 'vague.' She says its on such a subtle level that others can't perceive it. She says she doesn't want me to work on her because 'she is hurting me subtly and it might not be showing up yet, but it will and I will be sorry I ever had anything to do with her.' Her family brought her by force to the last session on Friday. I am scheduled for another session with her on Tuesday.

I've asked her "Where's your proof that you have hurt or are hurting others?" Her answers are vague: "Can't you see it?" "It's on too subtle a level for others to perceive."

She really does respond beautifully to the energy sessions, and leaves looking radiant, smiling, and feeling energetic, but still claiming she is hurting me by allowing it. Although in tears when she comes, I feel she is quite reluctant for the sessions to end.

The family says they have tried ever so many things and this is the only thing that has made a difference. However, it hasn't "completely cured her and doesn't last" so they have agreed to only one more session.

I encouraged them to do tests at the hospital ($100) for stroke detection. I don't think they will. The family has very little money. I am doing 45 minute sessions for $35, and have given her a free massage (which she loved). That's the best I can do.

I also feel the mercury fillings and gold crowns could be affecting her. She refuses to go to the dentist. I have given them the names of 4 differnet dentists who don't use mercury, etc. but she refuses and they don't have the money.

Before doing the work in person, I did about 4 distance sessions which I felt were effective, but the family and the girl didn't perceive anything. I think perhaps she is "starved for kind, human touch."

Really appreciate your interest. Any and all comments are welcome.

Hi Truth Lover,
With responses of such kind from the family: making excuses for change, I would muscle test both hers and family members willingnes to change the whole situation and release health issues.
I bet you don't want to be immersed in a midst of family dynamic drama.

Please be very aware about "completely cured and doesn' last" remark.
You don't and can't cure her. And her healing is her responsibility.

With Love,
Jelena

Good points, Jelena.
Yes, I have done muscle testing on "willingness" and also verbally asked. The family shows willingness and speak of wanting it. They seem desperate and exhausted. Muscle testing does not show the client as "willing" and she will not verbally say she is, only uses words like "what's the use of being willing? I'm hopeless."

My response to her is "What's the pay dirt for believing you are hurting others?" "What do you get out of thinking/believing this?" "What are the advantages/benefits to you for believing this?" I've also discussed these concepts with her family. No answers.

I believe the familiy uses the word "fixed" - not "cured" (my error in terminology). I believe they use that statement because they have no money and are defeated.

I actually don't have a problem with being in the midst of a family dynamic drama. Blessings to the training of Byron Katie!!!

I am clear that I don't heal or cure or fix. I do know when she comes, even when forced to, she leaves happier than when she came. That says to me that the life force energy/wisdom within her wants her to be happy. IT is willing. Her 'ego' (for want of a better word) prefers to hold to the illusion.

I could spend hours writing about my personal viewpoints of the situation, which would accomplish nothing.

My main thought in originally writing this group was to ask whether yin or yang might be the most effective in working with her. I find I am not at all comfortable in discussing a client like I have in this forum. I have wanted whatever feedback I could receive that might help her -- in terms of technique. I originally chose to have the sessions 5 days apart -- based mainly on the effect of the unan lasting apx. 5 days. I also was "guessing" that doing sessions every day might be 'too much' in a mental/emotional situation. I didn't start doing core with her until about the 3rd session.

Thanks for caring - sharing -

Thanks, Ali, for sending the forms.

Me again!

I'm grateful for the training Alain has shared so generously!

A few quotes from his 7-23-09 (?) talk:

Allow - No Strain ,. . .
Clouds will unfold when they unfold!
No expectation - just possibility -- just wonder.
Just wonder about someone and wonder if . . .the possibilities . . .
Don't require anything!
Who are you working on when you are working on someone else? Yourself!
I'm an unlimited being, pretending to be limited.
We tend to want to DO - rather than to BE.


My favorite books:
Byron Katie's
Disappearance of the Universe, by Gary Renard
A Course in Miracles

Peace and Smiles to all . . .

Hi Truth Lover.

Quoting a little from your initial post regarding this person.

"I have a client who hallucinates that she is harming other people subtly and she has gone into an extreme reclusive lifestyle so as to not hurt others. Would you suggest yin or yang energy to help restore balance? Any suggestions are most welcome.

She responds beautifully to the energy sessions, for about 8-12 hours. She is radiant afterwards, then goes into an intense fear of how she is hurting othrs."

Now here you appear to have a person with victim mentality probably brought about and continually re-inforced through corrosive family dynamics where she has become the "lightning rod" for various persons to discharge their projections against and this is quite typical particularly in families experiencing a crisis or where strong religious beliefs or various mechanisms of control are being used to influence persons within the enclosed atmosphere.

So therefore this person is being literally drained of energy and to survive she has become what might be termed an energy vampire though to her as a person this is repulsive and unnatural, hence a sense of guilt and this is being expressed through her statements that she is "subtly" harming others which may in fact be quite accurate given that these processes are subconscious though she seems vaguely aware of them but can only expesss the concept in clumsy terminology which appears irrational to most.

Now such a person would probably do quite well if removed from the enviroment where this harm is being done and additionally she should make use of the services of a psychologist familiar with such situations.
When closely examined this person is not in actuality an energy vampire or parasite, rather she is the victim, her energy field is being constantly supplemented and recharged by the practitioner only to be discharged again by engaging in a cycle of negative thinking and contact with the real energy vampires who constantly drain her.

Off course without seeing this person the above is just a guideline based on experience dealing with others though it might ring a bell.

Regards.